Tuesday, March 15, 2011
Rhetoric and Statis
Crowley’s book was interesting to underline the importance of statis. I do not remember reading about it before (if it was in Touliman’s book, probably I did not understand it). This comment stood out for me not just because it was new information for me, but it is a very common problem today’s arguments. People having different ideas on subjects just state their ideas and try to prove the legitimacy of theirs but their argument, claim does not have any relationship between the other side’s ideas or claims. So they are arguing together for different things.
I believe the most recent sample for this is Libya sample. Protestors and people in Libya want a change in the country because they think their country is not a democracy and they are not happy with the current government. They want the president resign. On the other hand, the president claims that there is no reason for him to resign, some people governed other countries more than him, and it is not Libyan people who started these rebels but other people. They do talk about the same problem but they “do not agree on the point which they disagree…” (p. 29).
This is the same with some of the political discussions. I do not remember how many times I though “What are you talking about, he did not ask you this” while watching discussions on TV.
Hayley, his comment “I use the masculine pronoun here because the liberal subject is coded as masculine” (p. 35) reminded me of you:))
Thursday, March 10, 2011
Embodying Argument
Another example of this that's been in the news lately, is the Democrat walkout of the state Senators from Wisconsin. Having a controversial legislation forced upon the State Assembly without the expected political process, the dissenting Senators left the state, leaving the Republicans without the quorum necessary to enact law. At first I was skeptical of this move, but after a very interesting conversation in a coffee shop today, perhaps this rhetorical act by the Senators is more justified than I originally thought. With no other recourse for action, these lawmakers used their bodies to make very loud arguments about the legislation, about the state of democratic politics in Wisconsin, and about their role in the lawmaking process. Utilizing their silence as a rhetorical move is different than my understanding of protest, and leads to some very interesting questions.
This might be an example of a Performance, but that's a post for another day. Can you help me think of other ways to argue with your body?
Constructing the Audience, Collectively
Wednesday, March 9, 2011
Dialogue vs. Debate
The P & O.T also makes a great discussion of types of objectives of argument. I haven't finishes that chapter yet, but so far I believe they highlight very important components of argument: facts and truths, presumptions, values... I believe these are very important to have a great discussion and come to a solution as mentioned in the description above.
Tuesday, March 8, 2011
Perelman and Olbrechts-Tyteca: Argument and Possibility
Bittman on Subsidies
Instead of getting rid of the direct-subsidies, Bittman argues, we --as Americans --should look for ways to use them more effectively. Some of his suggestions are:
- Fund research and innovation in sustainable agriculture
- Provide incentives to attract new farmers
- Save more farmland from development
- Provide support for farmers who grow more than just the commodity crops that hurt the environment, the health of the nation, and the economic well-being of the country
- Level the playing field so non-agribusiness farmers can compete
What do you think? Is Bittman arguing differently? How has he 'reconstructed' the debate on direct-payment subsidies? Is his plan feasible? Will others listen? Is there enough incentive for those power/money/influence wielding few to buy into this course of action?
Descartes, Logic, and the Legitimization of Audience
Toulmin takes for granted Logic as an Epistemology that can explain argument. And while P&O-T don't necessarily rail against the use of Logic as principle assumption in forming arguments, it is certainly clear that these authors feel that stopping at Logic is not enough. In the Introduction, the reader is presented with the Descartian ideal of Logic approaching a science, and the desire by many Enlightenment philosophers to argue using this paradigm. However, P&O-T see this as a method for proving what is self-evident, a pursuit that is limiting. They see rationalist argumentation as "a perfectly unjustified and unwarranted limitation of the domain of action of our faculty of reasoning and proving" (3). This quote alone helped me understand Toulmin's work more thoroughly because I was able to compare his assumptions to another model.
I feel like the P&O-T model is more in line with my understanding of Rhetoric and Argumentation. The intellectual milieu of the 21st century is different than when these texts were written, but I see this more-inclusive, more-complicated, more-exploratory vision of Argumentation as more-sympathetic to our current reality. The aspects of TNR that show me this are held in P&O-T's inclusion of Psychology, a wider view of Text, and a greater importance of pathos to create a more-realistic vision of what it means to argue. Most importantly, however, the reason I see this as a better model for explaining how and why people argue, is the fact that they (re)legitimize the importance of audience in the production of arguments. Like Nilu, I see the importance AND the complexity of considering the audience as a part of the rhetorical situation, but without it, any understanding of Argumentation is incomplete, close-minded, and faulty.
After posting here, I will go over to my Personal Blog and try and extend some of these thoughts on audience in a more pointed way.
Monday, March 7, 2011
Audince in argumentation
I am writing a paper (for almost a year, I hope I will be able to finish it) on affect of socio-cultural norms on address forms. This paper is on politeness theory and the main finding so far is that: people, if not addressed properly, even stop talking or lose interest in having conversation. So it is very important to know the values of the audience even to start a conversation and to make your message meaningful for them.
I remember reading a research conducted with lower-income students. Several math instructors made a research on a very poor country in Asia (I believe it was in Asia) to see the relation between school instruction and practical knowledge. Teachers asked one of the students “OK, you have ten dollars and you spend 5 on candies how much do you have”
Student “Ten”
Teachers “Be careful, you had 10 and spent 5 on candies. How much do you have left?”
Student “10”
It goes on like this for a while and at the end the student says “if I have ten dollars, I would not spend 5 dollars on candies, it would be wasteful”.
Money is very precious for these students. The teacher convinced the student to answer the question but could not persuade him in the rationality of the question. If the teachers knew, or paid attention how much $10 meant to these kids, I believe they would ask the question in a different way and would nor spend this much time with one question.
Adherence, Values, and Epideictic Rhetoric
Perelman emphasizes the importance of what he calls "adherence" in his discussion of argumentation and persuasion. It is not enough to engage in logical proofs of an almost mathematical precision. What is needed is an awareness of an actual audience who will be disposed to respond to a speaker based on the extent to which the speaker shares or moves their values. Forensic and deliberative rhetoric, as important as they have been seen to be in the history of teaching persuasion, do not cover the whole of what is needed when it comes to making arguments that persuade others. Perelman writes: "epidictic oratory has significance and importance for argumentation, because it strengthens the disposition toward action by increasing adherence to the values it lauds" (p. 50). Even more strongly, Perelman notes on the next page: "the speaker tries to establish a sense of communion centered around particular values recognized by the audience" (p. 51). In Perelman, I believe we do indeed see a "new" rhetoric in the sense that he seems to be moving towards an almost Burkean emphasis on identification here, rather than a traditional Aristotelian emphasis upon logical proof.
Perelman's emphasis on values, communion, and adherence raises very interesting questions that once again (as with Toulmin) move us towards a more realistic view of how people actually engage in argumentation. Who defines the shared values? How do they come to be the values of that audience? That speaker? To what extent does the appeal to values involve an "appeal to a universal order, to a nature, or a god that would vouch for the unquestioned, and supposedly unquestionable, values" (p. 51)? As a preacher working in diverse communities, I recognize these questions as real and significant, and I take them seriously every time I get in the pulpit. Looking forward to more reflecting on this in days to come!
Thursday, March 3, 2011
For Nilu
It's a wonderful description of how contrastive rhetoric plays out in the first-year Composition classroom.
Flushing Out Epistemology: How it is that we know what we think we know & how it is that we claim to know what it is that we think we know
Toulmin's Model
The Conclusive Shift
Have I been arguing that only analytic arguments can be conclusive? Certainly arguments alone are analytic--and so, in the professional logician's sense, 'conclusive'; but in other fields also a time comes when we have produced in support of our conclusions data and warrants full and strong enough, in the context, for further investigation to be unnecessary--so in this sense non-analytic arguments can also be conclusive. (216)If we accept Toulmin's redeployment of conclusive, I think here we can agree with Tannen that many debates will have only one side worth knowing (e.g. the Holocaust.)
Wednesday, March 2, 2011
“Logical-looking answers to psychological-looking questions”!
Reliability and unreliability in the arguments
Tuesday, March 1, 2011
Analytic arguments, Quine and Toulmin
Yet, I wonder, how it is that some warrants would be deemed to be “reliable” and others not? Is it, as Rorty would contend, a matter of whether society allows us to claim it as true? And, if then, what is “society”? Who decides? One of the exciting things about inquiry is to question assumed truths. Yet, at a certain point, we do just need to sit down and talk with one another!
One of my hopes is to teach a course on communication ethics. It certainly seems that this question of reliable warrants would be particularly sharpened when making ethical arguments. Hmmm…a possible semester project?
Warrants- Returning to Toulmin as a path to arguing differently
From Toulmins framework it seems as though the implicit nature of a warrant would then seem to be a reason why it may be hard to explicitly identify in a source, and even harder to articulate. I could imagine this being a problem not just for undergraduates, but for us (academics) as well as politicians. For example, it seems as though some of the political debates that the public are privy to watch or listen to may miss the mark when it comes to identifying the warrants and engaging arguments on their basis. Additionally, when thinking about arguing differently we may come to see that this could be just including the step of identifying warrants, engaging debate through warrants, and thus returning to a Toulmin model. Thoughts?
(1)- Toulman, S. E. (2003). The Uses of Argument. NY:Cambridge University Press.- p. 92
(2)- Toulman- p. 93
The new language of argument?
Sunday, February 27, 2011
Do I argue differently?
I also believe that in a discussion providing warrants is very important. But when I turned to my own conclusions, arguments, I recognized that I skip providing warrants most of the times, to be honest if I am really engaged into discussion I sometimes do not really think about them either. I believe recognizing this is a huge gain for me. After reading this chapter and the comments in the class blog, I tried to be more careful about stating my warrants in our last Turkish community weekly meetings. It was so interesting how people did not really focus on the conclusions but the warrants more, discussed about them and the conclusion came out automatically.
It was fascinating to see it!!!
Thursday, February 24, 2011
Teaching Toulmin and Recognizing Warrants
Being able to articulate the warrant, it seems to me, is crucial to understanding an argument, and also to being able to listen generously to someone else’s argument. If part of our goal is to argue differently, to be able to, in Aikido fashion, move alongside someone else who may differ from us, it seems to me that doing so means being able to name the warrant in our own position, and in the other person’s position. The warrants may be diametrically opposed (as in the abortion debate), but they may just be implicit and not well understood, even by the one holding the position.
One of the reasons I enjoy philosophy (and particularly philosophy of language) so much is that good philosophical investigation, it seems to me, asks us to step back and examine the warrants in our arguments. How does this connect with that? What assumptions are we making to connect that data to that claim? Do we really have a warrant for using this example to support our position? Could we grant that someone else’s position is, in fact, based on the same data, but seeing it through the lens of a different warrant?